Still Becoming One
Still Becoming One
Holiday Boundaries Without The Drama
The calendar turns to November and suddenly every old family role shows up at the front door. We get real about why gatherings can feel so loaded, even when you love your people, and how to protect your marriage and your mental health without ghosting the holidays. Our approach starts with two anchors—honor and honesty—so you can appreciate the good, name the hard, and walk in with clarity about what you can and can’t expect from parents and extended family.
Welcome to the Still Becoming One podcast. We are Brad and Kate.
SPEAKER_01:In our more than 20 years of marriage, we've survived both dark times and experienced restoration.
SPEAKER_02:Now, as a licensed marriage counselor and relationship coaches, we help couples to regain hope and joy.
SPEAKER_01:We invite you to journey with us as we are still becoming one.
SPEAKER_03:Let's start the conversation. Hello there, welcome back to Still Becoming One.
SPEAKER_01:Welcome. Guys, this is the best you get on a Monday morning.
SPEAKER_02:It is.
SPEAKER_01:Um, I didn't do my hair shocker, and that's what you get on a Monday morning. I get really excited. Oh, you know, curly haired girls, we gotta do what we gotta do. Any other curly haired girls out there, you know exactly what I mean. We can't just get up and go. Brad said the other the other day to me, I was like, I got up, I looked in the mirror, I was like, wow, what did you say? It was like so good for you because you tend to not be this way. It was so fast. You were like, hey, I grew up in the 80s, I like 80s hair. And I was like, oh my word, my hair is a little uh big large, large, yes, just sleeping on it at night. That's all it takes for me. So I had to calm that down in the shower. So this is we got the team version. Sometimes Monday mornings we podcast, but we do admin stuff, so I don't unfortunately, I don't always get up and get myself looking the same as I do the rest of the day. Sorry, guys.
SPEAKER_03:That's all good. That's all good, but now we're doing videos, so I know, but I warned everyone with the first video.
SPEAKER_01:Don't it be expecting? Okay, Monday is my day off, so you're getting the real Kate. But isn't that the whole point? Brad and Kate have always tried to be brutally honest with you. And now you're brutally honest with my hair.
SPEAKER_03:If you uh don't follow us on Instagram or Facebook, you can find us at Still Becoming One, and you get to at least see some clips of us recording the podcast.
SPEAKER_01:And uh there you go, give it a little preview, and my hair will be done some days, just depends. Just depends. It's gorgeous. So I know, I know.
SPEAKER_03:So believe it or not, it is November, and it is time for people to start thinking about holidays.
SPEAKER_01:I was like in my brain, is it? I don't know. Uh do you ever get there? You're like, wait, what century are we in? What month? What okay? Yeah, November. All right, got it.
SPEAKER_03:You know, and and I we always kind of joke, but we totally understand it as well. This is one of those seasons where I'll have clients that I had ended with, you know, a while back or, you know, whatever, go, can we meet? Because they're trying to think through how do they handle Thanksgiving? How do they do family thing well? How do they prepare themselves, their spouse, their family to go visit extended family, um, and whether, you know, both sides sometimes, and you know what comes up and how do you navigate that really well.
SPEAKER_01:And, you know, I think that's so valid. It it doesn't really matter. Let me say this. It doesn't matter if you have a close relationship with your family or not. These are still things to think through. Absolutely. Although we can honor a lot of people have um complex relationships with their families where they might look forward to the holidays, but also have some anxiety about certain parts, certain themes could come up, certain family members, certain, right? Like it, it's complex.
SPEAKER_03:And um I think that we often end up dealing with a complex. I mean, we can talk for a minute about the people who thoroughly enjoy hanging out with their family and and really look forward to that time. I think that's that's fantastic. It's awesome. I think it is still a challenging couple time. Sure. Because it's just a different dynamic. You're bringing different people in. And, you know, we often say that even if you really get along with your family, going home or being with your family is often like a puzzle piece that falls into place. Yeah. And your spouse often doesn't have a place in that puzzle. Sure.
SPEAKER_01:And so it becomes a or they're trying to figure out for some families, it's a very easy transition. For others, it's a it's a challenge, right? They're still trying to figure out their peace in your family, and maybe we'll do that for the rest of their days. It just it just depends.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So it it that then becomes a couple dynamic for the two of you to navigate together of how do you take care of each other even while we're really having fun with our family kind of thing.
SPEAKER_01:I would even push back on you saying, like, if you feel like you have it's always a great time, then that's awesome. I would say if you're being honest with yourself, there are complexities, right? There cannot be. And I would say you've either done some really good work to understand the complexities, to be able to honor them, but also being honest, or you've just shoved it all away.
SPEAKER_03:Yes. Because when we're talking about family, we always try and start with an honor and honesty approach that we want to bring honor to our parents, to our family, to be honoring of the important place that they play in our lives, and just that reality that we wouldn't even be here without them. So there is an honor part that we need to start with.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And we use that honor part in many ways to also kind of go and and get to that honest part and be able to say without dishonoring, there was stuff that was hard. And I think we often, when we're working with with couples, when we're working with individuals, we often run into people who have not been able to give themselves permission to have that honest part. They get very stuck in the oh, my family is great kind of place. And I'm not denying, I'm there is lots of great part. That is honor. Yeah, of course. But I hear so many people that once they kind of go, okay, I can honor who my mom was, I can honor who my dad was, and then I can tell this other story that it all of a sudden goes, I man, I this thing's been hanging out here for a long time, and I don't even quite understand. And sometimes they are very complex, difficult, hard stories. Sometimes they're stories of things happening that the parents never knew.
SPEAKER_00:Sure.
SPEAKER_03:Other times there are things happening that the parents did in in maybe even very simple ways that they didn't end up taking care of the little kids' feelings in the middle of that. And sometimes they're real stories of harm.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So it, you know, we always try and say we don't want to try and minimize the stories that you are uncovering in being honest. Doesn't matter if they're really big tea trauma or they're little tea trauma, or they're sometime that your parent didn't see you, or sometime that your parent harmed you. All of them are wounds, and we carry them.
SPEAKER_01:So how does this impact holidays?
SPEAKER_03:Well, okay, here's the first you were wanting to like right. I hear a lot of people that as they uncover that honesty, they then want to kind of run back to their family and go, hey, do you remember this time? And and talk through the the hard.
SPEAKER_01:So if I'm understanding, you're saying when someone is doing story work or even just therapy, because sometimes people get to these things through different, um, different ways, that they realize the hurts, the harms, the whatever it may be, and then they feel like they need to have a conversation with their parents about it.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And that can be beautiful, right? Right? It can be the start of some real healing.
SPEAKER_01:Well, what a beautiful thing if your parents can join you in that.
SPEAKER_03:There's the real question, right?
SPEAKER_01:What a beautiful thing. If they can, I already have insights on either the family you grew up in or the work your parents have done. Correct. But that's not where the majority of people find themselves. No.
SPEAKER_03:And that's exactly what I kind of where I was coming is so often it's like we just start scratching the surface of a story. And somebody's like, oh, I went and go in and talk to my mom about this. And and my gut goes like, oh my goodness, oh god, like I because I really want the person to be held well and to join them there. And so often that isn't what happens, and that gets really hard.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So you're saying, like, I think, and and this is where it comes into holidays, is often holidays is one of those times where people talk about stories and they talk about remember when? And do you remember when we had the Christmas with? And you know, and so it gets to be an easy time, maybe not easy, but a time to bring up those sometimes hard stories.
SPEAKER_01:It's either that or we're talking about hard topics of the world. Like it's just well, we'll get that.
SPEAKER_03:It's well, yes, but it I think you're right, it's a breeding ground for like all kinds of things, like right, and and I would I mean, my first caution to people is be really curious with yourself why you want to bring that story to your parent. What is it that you're looking for? What response is it that you're hoping to get? What is your goal in wanting to bring that incident event up? My guess is it is this hope that you'll actually be seen this time.
SPEAKER_00:That they'll get it, they'll have an aha moment, right? Kind of thing.
SPEAKER_03:And if that is your motivation, I want to bring a lot of caution that it is often really difficult for a parent who's not done their own work to bring those kind of responses.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And kindness for that heart of wanting, that reconciliation, of course. Like most of us, I can't say all of us, would absolutely want our parent to join us in that way. That is an a natural desire, a good desire. Um I usually encourage people, and maybe this is just kind of my bent, but you've always taught me like, what are you expecting from your parent in that? Which, as you say, most of us are expecting some sort of level of being seen and understanding. But then I always say, Hey, that may not be where your parent can join you.
SPEAKER_05:Correct.
SPEAKER_01:But you can learn something about the future if you have children. And if you don't have children, you have family, right? Where you can join your family in future generations in a different way.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Right? Like if your kid comes someday to you with that kind of conversation, which hopefully they will, believe it or not.
SPEAKER_03:No, absolutely. We want them to. We want the brain courage that in our own kids.
SPEAKER_01:Let's be honest, we do, but we don't.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, of course. But we miss every kid. Like we miss a tune, it is impossible not to. And so having that opportunity repair is such a huge gift, and that's what you're trying to give your parent. But if they haven't done any work towards it, the likelihood that they're going to miss you again, right? Or just make excuses, or just, you know, tell whatever is really high. And that can seriously dampen your, you know, your relationship and and all of those kind of things. So I would really encourage people to be really cautious with what stories they go home looking to tell and looking to, you know, get better insight into.
SPEAKER_01:So you're saying at the holidays, like taking that story home.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, don't. Oh.
SPEAKER_01:Don't unless you really I was like, yeah, no, definitely do it at a different time. If if if if you've decided is the best thing to do, I would encourage you not to do it with other people around at a time that's already carries a lot of stress and expectations, at least in most families.
SPEAKER_03:The only thing I would say you bring home is if you know you know your story that you've worked on happened in 1988, and you want to get some context to what else was going on in life in 1988. Sure, maybe there's some stories that you can learn.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and I have also heard some people approach siblings who feel safe to say, Do you remember that?
SPEAKER_05:Sure.
SPEAKER_01:What was your perspective? Because sometimes siblings are like, no, I I have right because we take in things very differently. Sometimes siblings do remember events and it can be very helpful and clarifying from their perspective. Remember, it is a different perspective, but what they saw happening or what they, you know, perceived. But yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So our first caution in preparing for the holidays is do not go back to your family expecting aha moments. Right. And I think lowering those expectations and going and trying to think through, hey, how do we how do we do this well and safely for everybody? How do we take care of each other?
SPEAKER_01:Well, if there's if we can't expect aha moments, what can we expect? And this is this is the challenge that I find is most likely, and this is not a pessimistic perspective. This is a reality of how we live out our stories, you can expect a lot of the same.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. A lot of the same will happen.
SPEAKER_01:I don't know what the same is for you. And I know for you and I, like that's been our experience with with both sides of our families. Like you just, it's the same. It's the same as what you grew up with, it's the same as how holidays, because holidays are kind of their own beast, so to speak, right? So it's like, okay, we're doing it this way again. And then I encourage people, and I don't know if this is where you're going, but I encourage people then if it's going to be somewhat of the same.
SPEAKER_02:What do you need?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And how do you honor yourself in that? And you know, I do also say, is it something a conversation needs to happen before? Because maybe some of those things are really destructive and really uh not safe, but that gets into story and dealing with things. But then yeah, what do you what I call them accommodations? We use that word in special education, but that's it's just what do I need for myself to I'll use the term get through that time. Maybe you'd like to say thrive as best as you can through that time. Some people might say survive through that time of being with your family or your spouse's family, right? Because your spouse's family can bring up things for you too in a different aspect.
SPEAKER_03:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01:So yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So I think it is awareness. You brought up, you know, right now things feel very divided politically in the United States and other places in the world.
SPEAKER_01:Oh wait, did no that's new? Nobody knew that? Yeah. Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_03:Just kidding. So, you know, politics, religion might be things that you choose not to talk about. And I say that as if it's really easy to just put up boundaries and go, no, we're not going to talk about that. When many of us have families that are like steeped in, let's say, you know, let's take religion. You know, church may be the only thing that they do. So when you ask, How are you doing? the conversation is around their church.
SPEAKER_01:Or the only thing you might have somewhat in common, or or not, right? Like sure, but like you could go to very different churches, but like you both go to church. Like, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I so I think sometimes it can be really hard to put up boundaries around different types of conversations. Um I know now that you know, I think in the past we used to say, hey, if somebody's throwing out things there or whatever, try your best not to engage and just take care of yourself. That can get really hard because it does feel like often somebody else's views are under attack, somebody is being hurt by comments that are being made. And so, how would you advise, you know, if somebody's going home to a place that is totally opposite politically than they are, how do they handle that situation, knowing it's going to get talked about, knowing there's going to be comments made?
SPEAKER_01:You know, I think it unfortunately there's not one answer, right? Like I think it really depends on your story. It really depends on the comfort level of your family. Some people, some families may have have set, you know, an expectation, whether it's spoken or not, of we can hash this out, but everybody loves each other at the end. Some it's if we start to talk about it, emotions get very high, people get very upset. Like it it really does depend. You've got to evaluate your own family and what they can handle. But also there's a like, is it important for my voice to be heard in this area? I mean, of course we want to be seen and heard, but I've learned to evaluate in certain spaces. Is it that important? Like, are they gonna they gonna hear me like in and honor me for what I believe and think? If they're not, I have chosen many times the path of the not I don't even want to engage it. Well, I don't I you're not safe um in that regard. I'm not saying they're not safe in other ways, but like so I just don't feel it's worth my time, my emotional space to have me share something that's right now a very emotional topic tied with so many things. And and for us being a multi-race family, like there's a lot of things in there for us. And so I I just don't engage then, which is hard because then you're just a listener. But I've also learned in my life, and you and I listen for a living, like there is something to be learned in listening. And I hear that, and I I understand your perspective, like being able to validate them, but it does then become a space where you feel like you're always validating someone else, and nobody's nobody's ever validating you. And that's hard.
SPEAKER_03:I think it's Instagram the brother and sister who have discussions with their mega parents.
SPEAKER_01:And I want to watch that. I don't know.
SPEAKER_03:Often we'll bring up topics that are happening, you know, politically and try to, you know, help you help them see other sides of it, and the parents are trying to help them see other sides of it. And at one point, I saw one is it a good healthy conversation? It's it's a little volatile.
SPEAKER_01:Oh never mind, I don't want to watch it.
SPEAKER_03:I I think the at one point the mother said, We do this because we love you. Just because we disagree doesn't mean we don't love you, which I really do think is everyone's hope. Yeah, is that they can actually get to that place of what you said of you know, go through some place that we disagree, but actually still love each other. Well, and that can be really hard.
SPEAKER_01:Absolutely. I also think you need to think about, be curious and honor what is your mission in that? Like you and I have decided not to be cheese. We haven't written it down and pasted on our wall. That would be weird. But like our heart's desire and posture with especially our children, because that is a different relationship than our parents, our siblings, like we want to accept and honor where they are and and be in a source of encouragement, a source of care, a source of being seen. You know, when they were about 16, we encouraged them. We were even talking about this with Lily when she was on the podcast of like, if you feel like you need to go to a different church, if you feel like you don't want to go to church, like we are now putting a lot more of that in your hands. Like you don't need to do what your parents are doing. And um, you know, so trying to honor who they are, where they are. And since that is our goal with our children, I hope that that flavors our family get togethers as we continue. Now, that is you and I's goal.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:We have four children, very different experiences, very different. Some have other parent, other birth parents. Like I can't say that our children are all going to adopt that. So that flavors it. You also have spouses that come in that have their own families, their own experiences.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Like there's so much in there. But I do think if you and I can have that posture, I'm hopeful that will bridge a lot of divides. I'm not naive to think it will bridge everything. But many of us are going into family situations where that is not the posture.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And I and I think that's uncommon that that is the posture. Although a parent would probably say it, that's not what they're actually living out. Sure. And in those cases, I think again, we have to look towards our family and go, what is it that our family needs? How do we walk through this as best as possible? And I mean, this sounds awful when we're talking about going to our family or to visit a family, but how do we put our armor on? How do we go being careful and go being wise and in walking into it in a way that we're ready to deal with whatever comes and then step back and heal from it? Right? And and so that means there's some pre-work, there's some post-work.
SPEAKER_01:Which sounds like a lot of work, which is why people don't do it. Correct. I was sitting here thinking, do we just bring our boxing gloves? That would work in my family. Right. That would work in my family. We'd all put them on and do it out.
SPEAKER_03:But then there's tons of damage that even even in your family that is used to doing that kind of stuff. It is there's tons of damage that has that. Well, and I would advise defensive armor rather than the offensive armor when you're walking into family situations.
SPEAKER_01:We don't actually put on boxing gloves. And actually, my family doesn't get together a ton anymore. Um, because of spouses, because of all different kinds of things. And so, but I I'm always joking, guys, with that kind of stuff. Yes, I do think it's more like well, I don't, I think you say defensive, but to me it's offensive. I think the defensive often is like I I have to manage this so I don't flip out. The offensive is how do I honor this is where my family is, but honor is hard and and take care of myself well prior, during, and after. Right? So I don't know that it's defensive. That's true.
SPEAKER_03:I and I like one of the offensive things that I would put in there, and we've talked about boundaries so many times on this podcast, but one of the things when I automatically say boundaries, people think about what I'm not going to talk about, what I'm not going to do. And I'm guessing those are pretty easy to list. Nope, we're not going there. The problem is you'll most likely hit those boundaries. So the offensive is what is it that we want to talk about instead? How do we want to move that conversation from that inappropriate topic or topic we don't want to go to to something that feels safer? And that's been a really important thing for me because I learned passive-aggressive methods of communicating that don't do that well, right? And kind of slide in the aggressive nastiness. I don't believe it. And um I learned those well.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:That's really hard. But I would suggest like that's this conversation thing of how do I how do I think through what are going to be the landmines and where do I want to go instead of landing on that landmine?
SPEAKER_01:Well, and I think even now, if I'm honest, like we now navigate to like our children, three out of the four are adults. And we honor that adult space that they are learning, figuring out their beliefs. So in family spaces, they share their thoughts, and they may not always be what we agree with.
SPEAKER_02:Correct.
SPEAKER_01:And maybe what we know family doesn't agree with. And it's like, how do we hold space for that? Right? And um allow them to have a voice and and not feel like they have to change that. It's just, guys, it just gets really, really complicated. Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_03:That's really good. Um, so I would suggest that there is some pre-conversations uh with your spouse specifically around okay, what does family time look like? And what are you going to need in order to do that family time, whether it be with your family, whether their family, what are we going to need together to do that well?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I think that's really important. I think, you know. During it, what do you need things before? What do you need after?
SPEAKER_03:How do I support you? Yeah. Right? Because I think so often, especially early in our marriage, I think I would tend to physically and emotionally disappear in your home, and you would kind of physically and emotionally disappear in my home. And I would getting a look. But um I would I I think that would happen just because we don't really know what we're supposed to do to support. And as we've taken care of each other better, as we know each other better, and as we understand stories better, I think there's places where our roles shift in what does it look like to support and be present and you know take care of our spouse during family time.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah. In yeah. And I I think we need to honor like you at your family. It feels like it should be me checking in with you. And I do think most times that's the case, but like I think it can go both ways of like you're in your family space, so that's going to activate certain things. But the reality is your family functions very different than mine, so that activates can activate things in me. Sometimes it's, you know, people um integrate really well with their in-laws, and that's not a thing. Sure. But for a lot of people, it's very, it's it's literally going into a cross-cultural experience. Yeah. You talk different, you eat different foods, you have different um traditions and habits around all kinds of things, right? And so, you know, how many times have you come into my family's home and been like, what? That's odd. Why do you do that that way? Or and we grew up vice versa with each other. So but very different families. And and and we would even say, even in the same community, you're gonna be different. Your parents grew up in different communities and have different experiences. Um, and so it doesn't matter if you grew up as neighbors, correct.
SPEAKER_03:So I I think that those conversations are essential. Don't assume that you know it's gonna be easy. Don't assume like, you know, have some conversations. What do you need?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:We always support like have ways that you can together take breaks. So if things do a conversation comes up, like it's oh, we're gonna go take a walk, or you know, something that can give you a break can be really positive. Yeah um, you know, and have some positive downtime afterwards. We were talking recently, and um, I said many of our families, our nuclear families kind of fun dynamics or fun traditions, I guess, would have been like legit fun, not just like legit fun traditions have been things that we've built as decompression after family visits or around family.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, yeah, some of them are just holidays in general. And holidays. That sounds like we only built traditions around holidays.
SPEAKER_03:But decompressions around holiday time.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Right? Or things that we did to make holiday time easier, and they become fun family traditions. So it's watching a goofy movie after um, you know, after a visit or something like that, or you know, doing uh, you know, food in a unique way or those kind of things. So I I think sometimes that recovery space, I guess, is what I'm kind of trying to get to, is really important, right? So process through what does it look like to have downtime and family time in a positive way after either after the holidays or after family visits, you know, have that space to reconnect with your spouse and do that well.
SPEAKER_01:Andor family, yeah. Because when our kids were old enough to understand and perceive the dynamics, although they're always feeling the dynamics, uh, we we would include them in it too, because they could vocalize and we would talk on the way home from family things, like how do you think that went? Like, you know, and it um yeah, I mean, that's what you get for getting a therapist as a dad, I guess. Let's talk about it.
SPEAKER_03:Um that's probably true. What if they want to opt out of like all the family expectations around the holidays? That they're just going, I I really don't want to go travel to my family this year. I don't really want to do this.
SPEAKER_01:I think your your nuclear family, and even if you are a single adult, that that is your nuclear family, like you get to have this space of asking yourself, like, what do I want to do? What parts would I like to be a part of? What parts would I not? Right. And being able to express that to some extent. With my family, it I've we just for better and for worse, have a little bit more blatant, like this is what we're doing, this is what we're not doing, kind of relationship, or like I'm not, I hear that, that sounds fun, that's not something I'm gonna do, right? Like, so some families have that.
SPEAKER_03:You're saying there's it with your family, there seems to be less expectations around, oh, you you have to come home for Thanksgiving or something like that.
SPEAKER_01:If yes, I do think that with my family. If anything, the expectations are hidden and you're not sure when you're hitting them and when you're not, but that's that's a whole nother subject for a whole nother day. But I feel like I can openly express to my family like we're just we think we're gonna hang out, we're gonna write, like I can express that. I don't, I think a lot of people feel that pressure. And I think asking yourself, like, what is it about that that I don't enjoy? Is it stressful? Is it whatever? And then deciding that as a family, whether that's you and your spouse, you and your spouse and kids, you just you, right? And then advocating for I love doing this with you guys, this part I'm not doing this year, or yeah, I don't want to travel this year. I I will miss you all, right? It's not, but like I think we do get to have a voice. And yet when I talk to people, that's the thing, and and especially when you and I do premarital, we always talk about the holidays, and it is a space where most young adults do not that we only do young adults in premarital, but yes, they are like, oh, but my family expects it, my family expects it, and it's like stop okay. I would just encourage anyone with children moving up into young adulthood, don't expect it. Don't expect it.
SPEAKER_03:And don't demand like everyone has to be here in this time, and we have to do it all together. And if you're not gonna be here, you're disloyal because you're putting on this huge tension on adult children who are then you know trying to like they're dealing with that tension. And I feel that so often from clients that the biggest thing that happens through the holidays is tension and stress because of all these expectations that are coming, and they don't want to disappoint a parent, sure, but they end up feeling like I'm disappointing my parent anyway because I'm not gonna be here on this certain day, or oh my gosh, now I have to travel. And I, you know, it's all of the expectations that I think get so heavy. And that's exactly kind of what I was going. Like, I think it is okay to at times go, no, I'm not, I'm, you know, we're not we're not doing it. We're gonna do friends giving this time and we'll get together for Christmas, or we're gonna do, you know, one parent, not the other. And setting up those boundaries can be really hard, but I think it's sometimes really important.
SPEAKER_01:And if you're the parents, be okay with it, right? Like this year, our oldest said, I'm not coming home for Thanksgiving. And I didn't realize that because he just told you. So, like there was that bit of communication. But the other day I said to him, Oh, I'm so sad you're not coming home. But I said, and I hope he heard, I'm sad because I we haven't seen him in a little while. And I would love to see you, not I need you home for Thanksgiving. Like, Thanksgiving to me is like a I love Abe Lincoln that he made it a holiday, but it's also to me like a eh, I don't know.
SPEAKER_03:But like But I think it's an eh because it's had so many expectations for us for so many years.
SPEAKER_01:That's probably potentially true. I also think I have always felt in my life Thanksgiving and Christmas are too close. Like it's like two power-packed holidays within 30 days of each other. And that's a lot. Like, I think I felt that even as a kid. It I I think a lot of people see it as the starting of Christmas. Granted, let's be honest, you can start Christmas a whole lot earlier. There's a whole podcast we could do, right, babe? Okay. Um, Brad does not agree with my stance on when Christmas can start.
SPEAKER_02:You just skip right to winter.
SPEAKER_01:I it doesn't have to be winter. Half the time it's not even winter here at Christmas, but I like Christmas and I think it should be a longer season. Anyways, it is a lot in American culture to have two very large holidays, um, I think for families. I think it's a lot, right? If you at Christmas and Easter, I realize those are Christian holidays. I don't necessarily mean that they have to be, but there's time in between, right? And so I I just think, yeah. I do think we have our own thoughts of Thanksgiving. Yeah. And obviously everybody has their own thoughts about holidays, but it it's more I want my kids to know I would love to see you, but really, like I can see you any time of the year. It doesn't have to be at the holidays. Right. And I don't understand like everybody has to be together for the I don't I don't get that sentiment. I don't know. It's something to to dig into story, right? Like, why does that send why is that sentiment so important?
SPEAKER_03:Of why everyone, everyone being there at the same time is so important.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, but specifically at these days, it's like to me, everybody getting together at different times. Well, and I that makes it sound like I'm pushing that. Do we what do you feel about that?
SPEAKER_03:I I have been trying to think through some of that dynamic myself. I think that has been this value um that I've grown up with. I don't, you know, I'm not sure I hold that same value or want to because I recognize the cost of that pressure. Right? Because I think that pressure ends up creating a dynamic where stress just enters into the season and enters into the holiday because we're trying to meet everyone else's expectations. And expectations like that do not actually foster healthy relationships. So I I think that's where I have tried to do my own. You know, we're just entering a season where we're not gonna have everyone together in our nuclear family for uh for Christmas, for you know, Thanksgiving. Like those are gonna start happening more and more. And I think there will be some emotions around it, but I I want to also honor that as other people are choosing their lives and their other things, like I don't want to be the stress in their life. Like I want to be the place that they come for a very other things.
SPEAKER_01:So well, and I think about your extended family who we're very close with. We do a zoom. I is it usually Christmas Day? Sometimes I feel like it's like sometime that week, sometime that week or Christmas, yeah. Sometime and we all just shoot the breeze for a few minutes, right? Like to me, because we're all in different locations, there's nobody nobody super close. I guess a couple of your relatives are close to each other, but you know, like to me that's what the holiday's about, right? Like right.
SPEAKER_03:There are other ways to reach out, there are other ways to touch base.
SPEAKER_01:Well, and we've encouraged our kids to spread their wings, and we have been very open. Hopefully, nobody will feel like we're Lancaster haters. We didn't grow up here, and we've never kind of I've never kind of felt like this is home. I don't think it'll be the last place we settle, but who knows what the Lord will do. Um, and I know, you know, Brad, you can share your thoughts on that, but we've encouraged them to spread their wings that they're this is not the only option in life is Lancaster. And that has and and some of them didn't start in Lancaster, right?
SPEAKER_03:So, like it just I we had a repair person in the house this last week, and the several by the way.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, they said at one point they were like, Oh, this is so great. Did you guys grow up here? Which is a very Lancaster County question. Question Did you guys grow up here?
SPEAKER_01:Do you ever remember getting that question in Chester County?
SPEAKER_03:Because it was much more transient culture, right? And a suburb of Philly. I like anytime that question happens, I have to remind myself to say no, because we grew up an hour away. So to most people, that's here. But in Leicester County, not Lancaster County, no, no, no, no. Right. So it like it it just means something, and I think that is a culture. We've talked to other people who've moved into this county, it's a very difficult county to integrate into. So I think we felt that I mean we've been here for 18, 17 years.
SPEAKER_01:I like and yeah, I mean, Kent's 22. He was two when he moved here, so 20 years. Yeah, so but it does, yeah, it is hard to connect to it is, but it's also just like, and some people love Lancaster County and that they grow. It's not that I dislike it, it's just has never I don't know, Chester County didn't really feel like home either. So I don't know, maybe that I maybe that's something in and of itself, but like we what my point in saying that is we have encouraged our kids go wherever you feel like right. So we haven't also like felt this need to keep them all close, to keep our chicks all close. And that's just our take. I don't, I don't know, and maybe because not all of our chicks started here, like but I think a lot of parents have a very like, I want everybody to stay close. And I even sit here and think, do I want them all to stay close? Would I enjoy the proximity? Sure. But I think them spreading their wings and figuring out their life and being given the freedom to do so is about something I value highly.
SPEAKER_03:And I think that dynamic has impacted so many holiday stuff. Is all right, you went away, so that means now you have to travel to come back to us, or you know, that's part of the expectation. And and I'd really encourage people as they're thinking through their holidays, if they have adult kids, think through what expectations they're putting on them, and how do you do that well? How do you kind of release some of the expectation, not the love, not the care, but release the the place of you have to's that end up adding a ton more stress? And then, you know, if you're feeling that, if you're feeling those that weight of things, I would really kind of try and think through, okay, what what is it that we want to really do and why? What yeah, what is what's going on with that? Is you know, is it just the obligation, or is there a place where you can put up some healthy boundaries, do it better?
SPEAKER_01:I'm sure we've solved all the issues. We have not. I feel like we kind of talked ourselves in a circle.
SPEAKER_03:Getting getting rid of the holidays is a really difficult time. Yeah. I encourage people to reach out and talk to somebody. There's so many emotions around this.
SPEAKER_01:And sometimes just talking to somebody can calm it down to the point where it doesn't it doesn't feel overwhelming.
SPEAKER_03:Like that would be one thing is go sit with your spouse and just talk about the emotions around the holidays. About your kids, about going, visiting, parents, all that kind of stuff. Just go and talk about the emotions. There's so many.
SPEAKER_00:And what do you need? What do you need?
SPEAKER_03:Guys, I hope that was something that you can at least talk about. Oh yeah, it was something and uh be able to be present with each other as you're still in this journey of working on becoming one together, and sometimes means really changing and with their families.
SPEAKER_01:For sure.
SPEAKER_03:Well, all right, until next time. I'm Brad Aldrich.
SPEAKER_01:And I'm Kate Aldrich. Be kind and take care of each other.
SPEAKER_02:Still Becoming One is a production of Aldrich Ministries. For more information about Brad and Kate's coaching ministry, courses, and speaking opportunities, you can find us at Aldridge Ministries.com. For podcast show notes and links to resources in all of our social media, be sure to visit us at stillbecoming one.com. And don't forget to like this episode wherever you get your podcasts. And be sure to follow us to continue your journey on Still Becoming One.